#61 - NFL Defensive Legend Cliff Avril: Crushing Real Estate After Crushing QBs

[00:00:00] Hey, welcome back to Passive Income Pilots everyone. I'm Tait Duryea here with my wonderful

[00:00:06] friend Ryan Gibson. What's happening?

[00:00:08] Tait, excited to get into today's show with Cliff Avril who was the Super Bowl champion

[00:00:12] in 2013 and played for the Seahawks and he played for the Lions. So we're excited

[00:00:17] to hear about what that transition was like going from 2012 Lions if you don't remember

[00:00:21] that 0-16 season to switching teams and then winning a Super Bowl. So we're going

[00:00:26] to hear about what that was like and what the main difference was in the locker room

[00:00:31] that really kind of made the culture of the Seahawks a successful organization.

[00:00:35] What's really cool is you have this awesome career like a pilot, right? And at some

[00:00:40] point you have to retire, right? As NFL players do. So what do you do after that

[00:00:46] career? I think Cliff has just crushed it in real estate and he's making the

[00:00:51] most of it. He's buying apartment buildings now. He's building luxury houses on the

[00:00:56] east side of Seattle and Bellevue, Medina, etc. And he's just he's taken a lot of what

[00:01:02] he's learned in the NFL and under Pete Carroll's leadership and he's kind of made

[00:01:06] and built his own team of experts in the real estate space.

[00:01:10] Yeah, Cliff is just a, what an amazing guy. He's got amazing energy. He's

[00:01:16] philanthropic. He's just amazing. And what I loved is that he was investing in real

[00:01:20] estate while he was playing in the NFL. We as pilots, we have a finite career.

[00:01:25] We have to retire at 65. Granted that's a lot further out than NFL players.

[00:01:29] There's a deadline and you got to figure out what to do with your money now so

[00:01:34] that you can continue generating passive income later. If you haven't listened to

[00:01:38] this show prior, just a quick overview of what we teach on this show.

[00:01:43] This is it's passive income pilots, but it's a really holistic show.

[00:01:46] We talk about tax strategy, asset protection, how to generate passive income.

[00:01:50] We talk a lot about real estate because Ryan and I are both real estate guys.

[00:01:54] And we talk about things that are occasionally related to the aviation

[00:01:58] industry like air medical issues and things like that.

[00:02:00] Ryan, what are your anything to add to that for anybody that's tuning in for

[00:02:03] the first time?

[00:02:04] No, I would just say that the show is brought together the aviation

[00:02:07] community and with an investing spin on it.

[00:02:10] And I think it's been a lot of fun. So with that, we're going to jump in

[00:02:14] to Cliff's interview.

[00:02:16] Enjoy the show.

[00:02:18] Welcome to passive income pilots, where pilots upgrade their money.

[00:02:23] This is the definitive source for personal finance and investment tactics

[00:02:28] for aviators. We interview world renowned experts and share these lessons

[00:02:32] with the flying community.

[00:02:34] So if you're ready for practical knowledge and insights, let's roll.

[00:02:38] Thank you so much for joining us, man.

[00:02:39] Thank you guys for having me, man. I'm looking forward to this. It'd be fun.

[00:02:42] Super Bowl champ.

[00:02:43] Ryan, did you watch that game?

[00:02:45] Oh heck yeah. I watched that game. That was the year that I moved to Seattle.

[00:02:48] So, you know, that was actually so Cliff, that was officially the year we have

[00:02:52] something in common, believe it or not.

[00:02:54] You left the lions that year and joined the Seahawks.

[00:02:57] And so did I as a fan.

[00:02:58] I was a lion's fan.

[00:03:00] I mean, I was a lion.

[00:03:01] I grew up in Detroit area and was a lion's fan my whole life.

[00:03:04] And when I moved to Seattle, I mean, it was addictive to get into the 12

[00:03:08] country Seattle fan base and just how good the Seahawks were that year.

[00:03:12] Oh, no doubt. No doubt.

[00:03:13] Now, don't get me wrong. I love my Detroit days.

[00:03:14] Detroit was a blast as well.

[00:03:17] But moving to Seattle, the fan base here at that time was unreal.

[00:03:21] To be honest with you, it was kind of like rock stars.

[00:03:23] Like the guys like legit rock stars.

[00:03:27] The fans are amazing, man. It was cool.

[00:03:29] Well, one of my one of the questions I asked you, we met at a meetup,

[00:03:32] Laka, who is on the show actually about five or six episodes ago.

[00:03:36] One of the questions I asked you at that meetup, I thought was just stuck

[00:03:39] with me so hard was the I said, what was the one difference between going from

[00:03:43] the most losing team in the NFL?

[00:03:46] I think the Lions were 0 and 13 or something that year

[00:03:49] to winning a Super Bowl championship.

[00:03:51] And the speed at which you answered that question was like mind blowing.

[00:03:54] So what was that answer?

[00:03:55] Yeah, no. Yeah.

[00:03:56] Went from 0 and 16.

[00:03:58] Now, I will say that happened five years prior to me coming to Seattle.

[00:04:02] So it was my rookie year going 0 and 16.

[00:04:05] First team to ever do it.

[00:04:07] Not something you want to necessarily be in the record books for.

[00:04:09] But then five years later to be one of the best teams

[00:04:13] with the Super Bowl trophy, but not just one of the best teams,

[00:04:15] but probably arguably one of the best defenses ever

[00:04:18] to be a part of something like that with so many Hall of Famers

[00:04:21] and different things like that.

[00:04:22] It was amazing.

[00:04:23] But more so than anything for me and how I live my life

[00:04:26] based on how those things played out is more so it ain't how it starts.

[00:04:31] Right. Continue, keep working, continue.

[00:04:33] Head down, keep grinding, keep putting one foot behind the other.

[00:04:35] And things will work itself out.

[00:04:37] One thing for sure that will happen is if you quit, nothing changes. Right.

[00:04:42] So we and that's kind of how I live my life.

[00:04:44] But that's based on really starting 0 and 16 being windless

[00:04:48] to becoming a part of something so special in history.

[00:04:51] Yeah. And I think one of the things that you that you mentioned to us

[00:04:55] at that meetup was culture, like the culture

[00:04:58] within the Lions organization was a lot different than the Seahawks

[00:05:00] when you showed up. Can you kind of talk about that a little bit?

[00:05:03] Yeah. And that's the first time I actually realized that culture

[00:05:06] and how coaches coach actually play a role in success.

[00:05:11] The coaches were completely different and no knock on the lines by any means.

[00:05:16] I think the NFL in general was kind of just ran like that.

[00:05:19] And Coach Carroll was just different in how he approached it.

[00:05:22] But with the Lions, those very militant, you got to have had on a certain way.

[00:05:26] Some coaches want you to tuck your jerseys and stuff in.

[00:05:29] And you got to have that.

[00:05:31] It's just very militant like from that perspective.

[00:05:35] But then and it was fear based, too.

[00:05:37] Right. You didn't want to mess up.

[00:05:38] He was afraid to mess up.

[00:05:40] When I got to the Lions, it was completely different.

[00:05:43] Or when I got to the Seahawks, it was completely different

[00:05:45] in a sense of Coach Carroll was, hey, no, be yourself.

[00:05:48] Wear whatever you want to wear.

[00:05:49] But whenever we get between these lines, just know you're at work.

[00:05:52] But we have music playing.

[00:05:53] We're shooting hoops for meetings.

[00:05:55] We had ping pong in the locker room.

[00:05:57] We had all kinds of different things to just keep it fun,

[00:06:00] but more so than anything, allowing guys to just be themselves.

[00:06:03] And I think Coach Carroll realized that guys can be themselves

[00:06:05] or get the most out of them.

[00:06:07] And so that was that I would say that was a difference

[00:06:09] between kind of what I experienced with the Lions going to the Seahawks.

[00:06:14] Yeah, that's really key.

[00:06:15] And now you're a real estate developer here in Bellevue, Washington,

[00:06:19] which is amazing.

[00:06:20] I've seen some of the stuff that you built and it's top of the market stuff.

[00:06:23] I mean, these are probably three plus million dollar houses.

[00:06:27] What did that Pete Carroll cultural difference, the laid back mentality,

[00:06:31] what did that kind of teach you about maybe what you do today in business?

[00:06:35] I think the biggest thing that Coach Carroll taught me with the mindset

[00:06:38] and how he approached coaching us in culture is being consistent

[00:06:42] and being dedicated to something, but making sure you enjoy it.

[00:06:46] Right. When I first retired, I was trying to figure out

[00:06:48] what the next move was.

[00:06:49] You know, I mean, I've been playing football for 15, 16 years.

[00:06:52] I was only 33 at the time, so almost half my life.

[00:06:56] So just trying to figure out what the next move was.

[00:06:58] So I tried media, I tried having podcasts and all these different things.

[00:07:03] Just trying to figure it all out.

[00:07:04] But one thing that kept calling me was real estate.

[00:07:07] And that was the passion part.

[00:07:09] Like, that's the piece that Coach Carroll was really good at.

[00:07:11] Just, hey, be passionate about what you're doing.

[00:07:13] And then again, just being dedicated to something like being all in study.

[00:07:18] And I don't know if I'm necessarily learning from Coach Carroll,

[00:07:20] but just being a professional athlete in general, in order to have success,

[00:07:24] to give yourself a chance to have success.

[00:07:26] Like you got to be all in.

[00:07:27] You got to, I'm talking about film study,

[00:07:29] you're talking about take care of your body.

[00:07:30] Got to kind of stop partying a little bit.

[00:07:32] You got to like there's a lot of different things that you got to kind of

[00:07:35] do to be a pro, but then to have longevity.

[00:07:38] So I just applied all those different things to trying to build out my company,

[00:07:42] build out my in building out these developments and different things like that.

[00:07:46] I try to tap into that stuff.

[00:07:48] Was there any other mentors you had that really played a role

[00:07:50] in learning the real estate side of things?

[00:07:52] I mean, Coach Carroll is instrumental in the philosophy and team dynamics

[00:07:56] and leadership, but what about like the technical part of learning

[00:07:59] real estate after the NFL career?

[00:08:02] Man, so as here in Seattle, the East Side, Bellevue, Kirkland,

[00:08:06] all these different areas, there's a lot of people doing a lot of cool stuff.

[00:08:09] A lot of wealthy people do a lot of cool stuff.

[00:08:12] And I've been fortunate enough to meet a few different individuals

[00:08:14] that are huge developers where they talk about high rises

[00:08:18] to mid rise to single family stuff.

[00:08:20] But in particular, when we talk about single family,

[00:08:23] my business partner actually was is a mentor to me.

[00:08:26] He's been in the game for 20 years.

[00:08:28] We have a great we've had a great relationship prior to even doing business together.

[00:08:33] So I'm able to kind of peel back the curtains a little bit

[00:08:36] and just be able to see kind of what's really going on,

[00:08:39] whether it's talk about the cost perspective of it

[00:08:41] or even just being a general contractor.

[00:08:43] And really, like when I thought of development,

[00:08:46] this is how ignorant I was, I guess, to it.

[00:08:48] And I thought of development when I thought of being a builder,

[00:08:50] I thought you were actually hammering hand and nails.

[00:08:53] No, you're managing people actually that have like

[00:08:57] that's just where I was when I first started.

[00:08:59] But to realize, no, it's all about managing people and being a leader.

[00:09:02] Right. All things that I've learned how to do plan this for the football as well.

[00:09:07] Just having a few different mentors in different spaces,

[00:09:10] whether you talk about, like I said, single family stuff

[00:09:12] and even some of the stress, multifamily stuff that we purchase.

[00:09:16] I'm big on learning.

[00:09:17] I'm big on looking for people to be able to help me as I go on this journey.

[00:09:22] I truly believe there's no finish line to learning.

[00:09:23] So so, Cliff, I want to jump into the mindset of like investing, right?

[00:09:28] Because we've all heard the stories of high flying athletes

[00:09:31] that end up broke at the end of their career.

[00:09:33] What was the difference? What was the catalyst for you?

[00:09:36] I was listening to you and another NFL player on bigger pockets.

[00:09:40] And you guys were talking about how you guys would play

[00:09:42] rich dad, poor dad during the workouts at 6am over the speakers.

[00:09:47] Like that was amazing.

[00:09:48] So you had this culture of what are you investing in?

[00:09:50] What are you doing? What's working out for you?

[00:09:52] And I think that high income professionals,

[00:09:55] really high income professionals like you, but also high income

[00:09:58] professionals like pilots always get they get linked up with a financial advisor.

[00:10:02] And it's like stocks, bonds, mutual funds and the real estate side.

[00:10:05] Nobody teaches you that you got to go out and find that.

[00:10:08] So how did you find it?

[00:10:09] And then how did you develop that muscle and that that idea

[00:10:13] for creating cash flow and passive investing?

[00:10:16] So when I played ball, when I was playing,

[00:10:19] I was also investing in real estate, whether it be funds

[00:10:22] and syndications and different things like that.

[00:10:24] And actually, I want to say my first real estate fund

[00:10:27] that I got into was via Marshawn Lynch.

[00:10:29] Just talk just talk about different investments.

[00:10:31] And I think that was the difference between, say, our locker room

[00:10:34] in most locker rooms.

[00:10:36] We were actually willing to talk about what we were doing with our finances.

[00:10:39] Right. It's kind of like when you get around family,

[00:10:42] most people don't want to talk about money.

[00:10:43] Nobody wants to talk about religion or politics.

[00:10:46] We were like, no, we're open book.

[00:10:48] Let's talk about all of it. Right.

[00:10:49] And I think that's how you learn.

[00:10:50] And that's what sports has taught me in general is

[00:10:53] got to have the conversation.

[00:10:54] And that's how you learn from other perspectives.

[00:10:56] But Marshawn taught he told me about a fund that he was in.

[00:10:59] He had partnered with the syndicator.

[00:11:01] He's done one or two funds with them and it's been going well.

[00:11:04] So then I started kind of doing my due diligence in a sense of just,

[00:11:07] honestly, when you get into it, you don't really know what you're looking at.

[00:11:10] But one thing I do know is numbers and so in returns

[00:11:13] and different things like that, so just kind of dive into it.

[00:11:16] So I invested in a few funds and those things were going well.

[00:11:19] But when I retired, now I really have time to actually pay attention

[00:11:23] to what's going on with my finances, because now I'm not sacking

[00:11:25] quarterbacks or anything like that.

[00:11:26] So I dove deeper into just what these syndications were doing.

[00:11:30] And again, great returns.

[00:11:32] But I was like, well, if I did it myself, I could probably make more.

[00:11:37] You know what I mean?

[00:11:38] Because I also understand the more convenient something is, right.

[00:11:42] The less your returns will be.

[00:11:44] It's worse, right?

[00:11:45] Because everyone that's put into work and has to get compensated before

[00:11:48] you get your return, right?

[00:11:49] So as I'm understanding and diving deeper into that's when I'm like,

[00:11:52] OK, you know what?

[00:11:53] Let me try doing this on my own as well.

[00:11:56] And it started off small, but I would say just having the conversations

[00:12:00] with Marshawn, Richard Sherman, Michael Bennett, Red Bryant.

[00:12:03] Like we would literally sit in our player development office,

[00:12:06] player development, Mo Kelly's office and just talk about a wide range

[00:12:10] of different things that guys are doing, investing under just getting

[00:12:14] a better understanding than like you said, we started playing

[00:12:16] Rich Dad Poor Dad and all these different books to just make sure

[00:12:19] that guys are into the younger guys are into what kind of the conversation

[00:12:23] that the older guys were at.

[00:12:24] That's so cool.

[00:12:25] Yeah, I think that just goes to highlight like your network

[00:12:28] is your net worth, right?

[00:12:29] And obviously, and then just building a community of sharing

[00:12:34] that information with each other, I think is just so powerful and awesome.

[00:12:38] And then I remember you saying that you could do syndications

[00:12:41] and the returns are going to be lower than if you go out

[00:12:43] and take a swing at doing it yourself because right,

[00:12:45] because you're doing all the work, you're putting together the deal

[00:12:47] and that's why you get paid and that's why you get your

[00:12:49] your piece of the property, right?

[00:12:50] And what was that like, though?

[00:12:52] I mean, because not active real estate is not cut out for everybody, right?

[00:12:55] Is there anything that you you kind of regret or that

[00:12:58] you've appreciated more or have you fallen in love with it?

[00:13:01] What's your take on that now?

[00:13:02] I am very much.

[00:13:05] I mean, I'm in love with it.

[00:13:06] I'm passionate about it.

[00:13:07] And I think the reason why I'm passionate about it

[00:13:10] is multiple reasons why I'm passionate about it.

[00:13:12] The reason why I'm even in real estate, like I said, based on conversations,

[00:13:15] but also meeting other individuals here in the city that that made their money

[00:13:19] in other spaces that end up buying and getting into real estate.

[00:13:23] But I think the biggest thing is.

[00:13:26] I mean, I'm only 30.

[00:13:27] Well, at the time, I was only 34, 35 years old.

[00:13:29] I'm 38 now, but being able to create that cash flow,

[00:13:33] I think you start reading all these different books

[00:13:35] and you start understanding kind of how money works.

[00:13:38] I joke with some of my young guys.

[00:13:39] I'm like, man, I would rather have these are random numbers,

[00:13:43] but I would rather have one hundred thousand dollars

[00:13:44] coming in a month from cash flow from real estate than to have,

[00:13:48] you know, two or three million bucks just sitting in a bank account.

[00:13:50] You know what I mean?

[00:13:51] Well, I'll take two million.

[00:13:52] Like, no, the cash flow is where it's at to me

[00:13:55] because I know this is coming in.

[00:13:56] Once you start pulling a dollar to a couple of hundred dollars,

[00:13:59] a couple of hundred now you had a million.

[00:14:01] Now you're like, oh, I should have took the hundred thousand a month.

[00:14:03] Right. But I'm just I just like the process, too.

[00:14:06] I think there's nothing cooler than special developments.

[00:14:10] Like you come up with this concept in your head.

[00:14:13] You see this a lot.

[00:14:14] Come up with a concept and get with these architects

[00:14:16] and these engineers and we're going to build this.

[00:14:20] And then 18 months later, boom, there it is.

[00:14:24] Whoa, like we really did.

[00:14:25] Like this is real live Lego Lego.

[00:14:30] I think there's I think that's pretty doggone cool to be able to see that.

[00:14:33] And then also you're providing housing like everyone needs a house.

[00:14:36] Right. Everyone now we are building more luxury homes,

[00:14:40] but everyone needs a house.

[00:14:41] So I think being able to be a part of that process,

[00:14:44] being able to see from A to Z kind of your everything

[00:14:48] you thought about and put together actually comes to fruition and you see it.

[00:14:52] I think it's pretty doggone cool.

[00:14:53] And then, of course, the returns are awesome as well.

[00:14:56] Totally OK.

[00:14:56] There's a lot that goes on between having that vision

[00:14:59] and 18 months later when the product gets delivered.

[00:15:02] Right. What's the biggest kick in the shins that you've ever gotten?

[00:15:04] What's the biggest setback you've had?

[00:15:06] I mean, you're going to take you're going to get a few kicks in the shoes.

[00:15:10] For sure. Through the process.

[00:15:12] I mean, even like on the project we have right now,

[00:15:14] we have a project going on in Medina,

[00:15:16] and we felt like we were very conservative on a lot of different things.

[00:15:20] But there was the architect and some of the engineers didn't catch this,

[00:15:24] but there were some issues with elevation.

[00:15:26] And it was so with the issues with the elevation now,

[00:15:31] that the plumbing and some of the sewer stuff was off a little bit.

[00:15:34] So now we had to come in with bigger some just some different things

[00:15:38] that come in and end up costing us like an extra 100K.

[00:15:40] That's something we did not budget for that we did not see.

[00:15:43] But the good thing is, again, because we're so conservative in our numbers,

[00:15:46] we're able to kind of pull from different spaces.

[00:15:48] But these are things that's one thing that's consistent with real estate is

[00:15:51] there's going to be something that comes up that you did not realize

[00:15:55] or didn't understand.

[00:15:56] And you just have to make sure you have contingencies for that

[00:16:00] to be able to weather the storm.

[00:16:01] But it's like a football game.

[00:16:03] And that's why I love it, too, is because there's so many similarities

[00:16:06] with football. It's like a football game.

[00:16:08] Like football games do not go the way you expect them to go every single time.

[00:16:11] I've been down 21 points in the fourth quarter.

[00:16:13] And somehow we found a way to win. Right.

[00:16:14] So you got to come away again.

[00:16:17] You just have to keep you just got to keep moving forward.

[00:16:19] You got to keep moving forward as long as it doesn't hurt you.

[00:16:21] And honestly, if you don't lose any money and you take it,

[00:16:23] you learn from it.

[00:16:25] That was just an experiment. It was a great lesson.

[00:16:26] Yeah, I love that right there, which is I think sometimes

[00:16:29] you're not going to win every game, but sometimes the games that you lose

[00:16:33] at the biggest winners, right?

[00:16:34] Because you take away a lot from the game.

[00:16:35] And as long as you don't, as long as you apply those lessons learned

[00:16:38] to your next project.

[00:16:40] But that is real estate.

[00:16:41] I mean, it's like going playing a bunch of games.

[00:16:44] Right. And you win some, you lose some.

[00:16:46] And you get better by losing and you get better by having a good

[00:16:48] culture and having a good product and listening to the numbers

[00:16:52] and paying attention to how you get better.

[00:16:54] And that's really what it's all about.

[00:16:56] What does in your world of real estate investing now,

[00:16:59] what is winning the Super Bowl to you?

[00:17:01] Like, what is the what is your just absolute

[00:17:04] just best scenario that you can what are you striving for today?

[00:17:09] So I'm going to give you the business model that I have,

[00:17:12] and then I'm going to tell you why and then how we get to the Super Bowl.

[00:17:16] So the business model is we build these luxury homes.

[00:17:18] We flip those and then I go by distress,

[00:17:21] most high family properties with that, with the proceeds from that.

[00:17:24] We buy twenty to one hundred units all in the Midwest or in the southeast

[00:17:29] region, and we again, my big thing is cash flow.

[00:17:31] So what so we do that.

[00:17:33] We flip those.

[00:17:34] Now, the main reason why I started CA family properties

[00:17:37] is because I wanted to be able to help my friends and family

[00:17:40] create generational wealth through real estate

[00:17:42] by being able to create cash flow for them. Right.

[00:17:46] But I wanted to build the platform for them because one, it's hard

[00:17:49] for people to invest with other people that they don't know or trust,

[00:17:53] especially if you don't come from a background of investing in general.

[00:17:58] So I want to create this platform for my family and friends

[00:18:01] because one, they know I don't need their money.

[00:18:02] And two, they like they know my heart.

[00:18:04] They know like who I am and what I want to do.

[00:18:07] So the Super Bowl for me is 10, 15 years from now,

[00:18:11] especially my friends that are around my age, is to be able to.

[00:18:16] Hey, guys, man, what are you all doing this weekend?

[00:18:18] Oh, nothing. Let's go to the Bahamas.

[00:18:20] Oh, let's do it.

[00:18:22] I don't have to put the bill.

[00:18:23] Everybody can afford it themselves.

[00:18:24] That's the way that is the wind for me.

[00:18:28] So that's my ultimate goal is to be able to help friends and family.

[00:18:32] I would like all my closest friends and family to be able to have enough

[00:18:35] income coming in to be able to move around when they want to.

[00:18:38] I think that that would be awesome for me at the age of 50

[00:18:41] to be able to do that with all my friends.

[00:18:42] That's amazing. That's great.

[00:18:44] And when you say your friends and family are involved in real estate investing,

[00:18:48] are you just educating them? Are they investing with you?

[00:18:50] What's your how do you kind of how do you keep them along for the ride

[00:18:53] or get them involved in everything? Both. OK.

[00:18:56] I think education is a big part of it because as I learn

[00:19:00] and that's what my all my platforms like my tick tock is all really

[00:19:03] about just my journey is I'm not telling you

[00:19:06] I know exactly what I'm doing, but I'm in the game.

[00:19:09] I'm figuring it out. Right.

[00:19:10] So as I go on this journey, I want to teach you as well,

[00:19:12] because information isn't really out there like that.

[00:19:15] And unless you're now I'm a podcast junkie, I listen to real estate

[00:19:19] everything. I don't even know what the hottest music out is right now.

[00:19:22] I know I hear there's a beef between Drake and Kendrick Lamar.

[00:19:25] That's the whole I know right now.

[00:19:26] I don't even know what the songs are.

[00:19:28] But I don't even know where I was going with that.

[00:19:30] Oh, yeah. So I just think that if I'm able to do that,

[00:19:35] I want to educate them.

[00:19:36] And then also they are investing with me.

[00:19:39] Now, I say that they've only invested in one project in particular.

[00:19:42] But my mom is like, I'm ready for the next project.

[00:19:45] Like these checks every quarter has been great.

[00:19:47] Like, I've never had money come in that I didn't have to work for.

[00:19:50] You know what I mean?

[00:19:50] So she's everybody's anticipating the next project.

[00:19:52] But yes, I try to let them invest alongside of me on some of my projects.

[00:19:56] But also education is huge for me.

[00:19:59] I want to teach them. I want to teach them.

[00:20:00] Yeah, I love that because there are when I got into real estate,

[00:20:03] people ask me, I've gone and spoken at my alma mater,

[00:20:06] my college about the business school.

[00:20:08] And I'll never forget some of the questions the students had, which is like,

[00:20:10] how did you what did you do to get the experience you have today?

[00:20:12] And I'm like, I listened to like over a thousand podcasts

[00:20:15] and I've read countless dozens, if not hundreds of books

[00:20:19] and all those things you can do from anywhere.

[00:20:22] And it's just incredible that and I think as a society,

[00:20:25] we want to share information and all that information is out there

[00:20:28] for you to take. And that's free, free, free or 20 bucks for a book.

[00:20:33] Yeah, it's so cheap to get that education, but it's a lot of work.

[00:20:36] It is. It is.

[00:20:37] But I think I think with most people and I hate doing generalizations,

[00:20:42] but I think with most people, I think the like

[00:20:46] you don't know what you don't know.

[00:20:47] And tapping into it is OK.

[00:20:49] Well, yeah, I have this Internet.

[00:20:50] But if I don't know what the Google I mean, so I think that plays a role.

[00:20:54] But also, I just think you've got to be like

[00:20:57] you also have to just be passionate.

[00:20:59] You got to find something you're passionate about and then dive all in.

[00:21:02] Right. Because Google is a great source.

[00:21:04] YouTube University, as they would say, is a great source to

[00:21:07] to be able to figure things out.

[00:21:09] And I know for me with the real estate piece is it is reading a lot of books.

[00:21:14] It is meeting a lot of people and it is podcast like podcast overload

[00:21:18] every morning, three hours of some sort of podcast.

[00:21:20] Top five podcasts or books you recommend if somebody wants to get into real estate.

[00:21:24] Oh, OK.

[00:21:26] Of course, we got to start off with podcasts or books.

[00:21:28] So that's good. Of course, you got to start off with Rich Dappord.

[00:21:32] I think that's just a fundamental book mentality. Right.

[00:21:35] It's the I mean, it's the world famous book.

[00:21:38] It's the gateway to just exactly.

[00:21:40] Exactly. Exactly.

[00:21:42] I like that all the bigger pockets, the platform in itself.

[00:21:45] There is a gazillion podcasts on there. Right.

[00:21:48] Thinking Grow Rich.

[00:21:49] I think that's another great book.

[00:21:51] Other than like passive income pilots, of course.

[00:21:55] That's passive income.

[00:21:56] Of course, you got to have that on there.

[00:21:59] I mean, the list is on.

[00:22:00] I listen to Rod Cleese, Lifetime, Cash Flow.

[00:22:02] There's financial freedom, real estate.

[00:22:05] There's so many out there.

[00:22:06] And then book wise, but those are my favorite two books

[00:22:09] that I try to listen to at least once a year.

[00:22:12] Yeah. And I think that's so important.

[00:22:14] I mean, the time that you can spend in your car on a layover for pilots.

[00:22:18] That's where I pick up a lot of my knowledge is like on the layover

[00:22:20] while you're going for a run or wander around a city.

[00:22:23] That way, you're flying.

[00:22:25] Yeah. By yourself. Yeah.

[00:22:26] But in the back of the plane, whatever it might be.

[00:22:28] I mean, you can always be Bluetooth in and jam into some new education.

[00:22:32] I think that's incredible.

[00:22:33] Yeah. Instead of putting a movie on while you're deadheading.

[00:22:35] Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

[00:22:36] John Wick 4.

[00:22:37] There can only be so many John Wicks out there, right?

[00:22:39] So. Exactly.

[00:22:43] In 2016, you vowed to build a home for each SAC.

[00:22:47] You got 11.5 SACs that season.

[00:22:50] Can you tell us about that?

[00:22:51] This is a bit of philanthropy that you've been involved in.

[00:22:54] Yes, yes.

[00:22:55] So that year, Haiti had just had a crazy hurricane, I believe, that came through.

[00:23:01] So I'm very passionate about Haiti as a country.

[00:23:04] Both my parents are Haitian.

[00:23:06] Used to go there every summer, visit my grandma when I was a kid.

[00:23:09] That's actually the only child that I ever did growing up.

[00:23:12] But they had a hurricane that came through and it was devastating.

[00:23:17] It took out quite a few homes and different things like that.

[00:23:20] So I wanted to find a way to get involved.

[00:23:23] And I also wanted to make it fun and get some other people to get involved with it.

[00:23:26] So fortunately enough, I bought out, we got 11.5 SACs.

[00:23:30] So that equals 12. The irony in that, right?

[00:23:32] So we ended up building 12.

[00:23:34] Well, I had 12 homes that I was going to build.

[00:23:35] But then I had some other people in the community that that partnered up

[00:23:40] with me as well and matched it.

[00:23:41] So we actually ended up building 25 homes that year for quite a few

[00:23:45] individuals back in Haiti.

[00:23:47] And it was amazing because we actually went back to see a majority of those homes

[00:23:51] and just seeing, I mean, we take so many things for granted here in the country.

[00:23:55] In this country, we look at so many different things that separates us

[00:23:58] and all this other stuff, but we don't realize how blessed and fortunate

[00:24:01] we really are to even have this type of communication, have electricity

[00:24:05] and all these different things where there's people around the world

[00:24:07] that don't have that on a daily. Right.

[00:24:09] So perspective is everything.

[00:24:11] But being able to go back to Haiti, being able to give back,

[00:24:15] being able to go back with my mom, I think is probably one of the more

[00:24:19] rewarding things that I've been able to do thus far in my life, because

[00:24:22] she was one of those people.

[00:24:24] She was one of those folks that lived in one of those small houses

[00:24:28] with seven, eight people in it, a two bedroom place.

[00:24:31] No, no infrastructure for sewage and nothing like that.

[00:24:34] So her being able to go back and being able to be a part of

[00:24:37] giving back to her country, being able to build homes, build schools,

[00:24:41] support so many different things.

[00:24:43] I mean, every time she went back, she just tears.

[00:24:46] So just being able to be a part of something like that,

[00:24:48] I think it was really cool.

[00:24:49] But again, being able to have the city of Seattle

[00:24:52] get behind me to also build some homes as well, I think is

[00:24:55] it speaks volumes to the city and the 12s.

[00:24:58] That's amazing. And you ended up building a school.

[00:25:01] Yes, we have a school in Haiti as well that we were.

[00:25:04] And again, this is conversations.

[00:25:05] Marshawn Lynch is the person that connected the dots there

[00:25:09] because he was doing some stuff in Africa.

[00:25:10] And he's hey, there's a group that I'm with.

[00:25:12] They also build in Haiti.

[00:25:14] My really? OK, let's dive into it and building the school,

[00:25:17] which was so cool, too, is Marshawn donated.

[00:25:20] Richard Sherman donated coach Carol.

[00:25:23] All those guys donated and built a building or a classroom,

[00:25:26] should I say, at my school as well.

[00:25:28] So it just speaks volumes to the guys.

[00:25:31] Yeah, no, I mean, and Marshawn

[00:25:33] started writing about it.

[00:25:34] He sounds like a hell of a good guy on the field.

[00:25:37] Yeah, by far one of my one of my best teammates that I've ever had.

[00:25:41] But it's been two guys that I played with

[00:25:44] that the perception and who they really are night and day.

[00:25:48] And Marshawn Lynch, one of them super amazing guy.

[00:25:51] I'm just a teammate, still my guy to this day.

[00:25:54] And then Adam and Sue, another guy that his perception

[00:25:58] and who he is are completely different as far as for just getting to know him

[00:26:02] on a personal level.

[00:26:04] Yeah, he played at the Lions, yeah, for a few seasons.

[00:26:06] Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:26:08] With the Lions and he's he won them.

[00:26:10] I think he won a Marine with that as well in the last few years.

[00:26:13] That's awesome.

[00:26:15] So how did can I just dive into that a little bit more?

[00:26:18] Like, how did that actually work? Nuts and bolts.

[00:26:21] You decided you want to build these houses in Haiti.

[00:26:24] How did you did you fly down there?

[00:26:27] Did you find builders down there to actually make it happen?

[00:26:29] Did you design them?

[00:26:31] How did that work?

[00:26:32] No, that's a great question.

[00:26:33] So of course, because we don't live there, it's very difficult.

[00:26:36] So it's partnerships as teamwork, right?

[00:26:38] Just like anything else.

[00:26:39] No one can do any anything in real estate or any other business by themselves.

[00:26:44] Right. So we partner up with the organization, did our due diligence,

[00:26:48] did a lot of vetting.

[00:26:49] It took a while, to be honest with you, because there's a lot of people

[00:26:52] say they're doing things that they aren't really doing.

[00:26:54] And so we partnered up with this organization called We at the time

[00:26:58] and they're doing some research, going to visit

[00:27:02] the lot that they were looking to build it

[00:27:05] because there was actually a school there already that housed 500 kids.

[00:27:09] And you got to see it was like the classrooms were split by blankets,

[00:27:13] essentially for 500 kids.

[00:27:15] So doing the research on the organization,

[00:27:19] one thing that I was very adamant about was making sure that it was

[00:27:22] all Haitian workers and Haitian companies that were building these.

[00:27:25] So it can stimulate the economy as well.

[00:27:27] And once we gave them a go ahead, we were going visiting.

[00:27:31] We were visiting every three to four months, whether it was me or my team.

[00:27:36] A few times, Marshawn went without me with my team

[00:27:38] to go out there and check on it because he was retired actually that same year

[00:27:42] and then came back, of course.

[00:27:43] But he was retired that same year.

[00:27:45] So he would travel and go check on the school as well before it was completed.

[00:27:48] And then when it was completed, we all went back

[00:27:50] at a big little party at the school for all the students and all that good stuff.

[00:27:54] It was a good time. It was it's very impactful.

[00:27:57] And it probably means so much more to me be able to do it

[00:28:02] because again, just knowing where my mom comes from,

[00:28:05] knowing where my dad comes from,

[00:28:06] and then again, being able to go back and build an infrastructure

[00:28:09] for people to be able to learn.

[00:28:10] Because I think education is the way to get out of some of the things

[00:28:13] that they have going on in that country.

[00:28:15] So that's my way of being able to hopefully get back in,

[00:28:18] hopefully put them on the right trajectory.

[00:28:20] So incredible. And that's what I love about money

[00:28:23] unlocks so many wonderful things in the world. Right.

[00:28:26] And it's not a zero sum game just because someone else

[00:28:29] someone's making money in a real estate deal doesn't mean

[00:28:32] it's taking any money out of your pocket.

[00:28:33] There's very it's interesting today.

[00:28:35] There's just such an attitude against building wealth, like wealthy.

[00:28:39] It's there. There's this class warfare and it's there's so much philanthropy

[00:28:42] in the world because of economic drive.

[00:28:45] And it's just so wonderful. So well done.

[00:28:48] So to talk about that a little bit, I don't necessarily understand it.

[00:28:52] But what I will say is like

[00:28:56] coming from where my people come from and being able to have opportunities

[00:28:59] to be able to create wealth, right?

[00:29:01] Being able to make money, not even just trade,

[00:29:03] just being able to make money is a blessing in itself.

[00:29:06] Right. Because that's the only reason my parents are here

[00:29:09] and they came to the United States was for the opportunity

[00:29:12] to be able to work. Right.

[00:29:13] Didn't matter what jobs didn't matter where

[00:29:15] just wanted to be able to provide for their family. Right.

[00:29:18] That's the ultimate goal for everyone, I feel like it should be

[00:29:21] to be able to provide for their family.

[00:29:23] Now, how far you want to take it and how that's on you at that point.

[00:29:26] Right. Like we're all in this race by ourselves in a sense.

[00:29:29] But I'd like to if I'm going to do something,

[00:29:32] I want to be the best at it.

[00:29:34] So why? And in being the best at something, you get compensated for it.

[00:29:38] You know what I mean?

[00:29:38] So to me, it's all about building, making as much money as you can

[00:29:42] so you can give back as well.

[00:29:43] I'm big on serving.

[00:29:44] I think we we are all here to serve one another.

[00:29:47] But in order to serve, you have to have resources.

[00:29:49] And that's where I think money comes into play.

[00:29:51] Yeah. And wealthy individuals that I talk to always the theme is always

[00:29:55] it's fun making money, but it's all about giving it away.

[00:29:58] And it's more enjoyable when you hit that stage of life

[00:30:01] where you can do that or that stage in your well to do that.

[00:30:03] And you are shining example of giving back

[00:30:07] and really making a difference in the community.

[00:30:08] That's really great.

[00:30:10] Getting back to the money making side, how do you identify your properties?

[00:30:13] What's what's a typical what's it right down the fairway project for you?

[00:30:18] Look over in Bellevue for building the new houses.

[00:30:20] So for building a new house, we only participate.

[00:30:24] We only look for lots that are in Medina, Bellevue, Kirkland and Clyde Hill.

[00:30:30] So we like the luxury market.

[00:30:32] And one of the reasons why we like the luxury market is because this area

[00:30:35] in general is is a bubble in comparison to most other cities and states

[00:30:40] where it comes down to the type of folks that are going

[00:30:42] to be able to afford these homes.

[00:30:44] But also, you got to remember, it's supply and demand, too, right?

[00:30:47] We're stuck between water and amount.

[00:30:50] And you got to do what you got.

[00:30:52] The closer you are to the water, the more it's going to be right.

[00:30:55] So that that's a big role.

[00:30:57] And then being able to maximize being able to maximize square footage

[00:31:02] on the lot is important, too.

[00:31:03] But also making sure that it's actually a functional home

[00:31:07] in the sense of someone that has kids, they can go out

[00:31:09] in their backyard and play there.

[00:31:11] They have a front yard like I'm big on that because my first home

[00:31:15] that I bought here in Bellevue actually didn't have that big of a backyard.

[00:31:19] And we had to move because of that, because of my kids couldn't go outside.

[00:31:22] So now I'm thoughtful in that way in how I try to build

[00:31:26] how my team, should I say, tries to build.

[00:31:29] And then and then it's also just understanding the market,

[00:31:32] understanding how much is going to cost you to borrow money,

[00:31:34] understanding how much is going to cost the bill.

[00:31:36] Fortunately, my business partner again is a general contractor,

[00:31:39] and he's been doing it forever in a day.

[00:31:40] So he can put the numbers together fairly quick

[00:31:42] and we can go after deals a little quicker if we wanted to.

[00:31:46] And being partnered with a business, having a partnership with a contractor.

[00:31:51] There's also no change order fees, right?

[00:31:53] There's no like there's a lot of fees and different things

[00:31:56] that you're able to bypass because you all are business partners

[00:31:59] and you all want to maximize on the profits.

[00:32:01] So being able to do that, I think is a great structure

[00:32:04] for him and I and his wife and my wife, of course.

[00:32:07] And it's been working.

[00:32:08] But Bellevue, this area in itself is unique in comparison to say other place.

[00:32:13] I don't know if I'd be able to do what we're doing here

[00:32:15] and replicate that in other cities to be able to get the same types of process.

[00:32:18] Yeah, the market here is, I mean, the number of businesses

[00:32:21] that are headquartered in and around the Puget Sound is intense.

[00:32:24] I mean, Costco, Starbucks, Microsoft, Amazon.

[00:32:27] I mean, just the number of employers here and the wealth in the area.

[00:32:30] It's really insurmountable.

[00:32:32] How did you go about building your team?

[00:32:33] I mean, it sounds like you very quickly.

[00:32:36] I mean, you're obviously had a really great career in the NFL

[00:32:40] and then transition to in having good mentors among your team learning.

[00:32:45] And then, OK, I'm going to settle on these markets

[00:32:48] and I'm going to build a team here.

[00:32:49] Like, how did you go about doing that?

[00:32:50] What characteristics do you think are required to do something like that

[00:32:53] for someone to look looking to get into active real estate?

[00:32:56] I'm big on referrals with different people that I know,

[00:33:00] that I trust, that I've possibly done business with,

[00:33:04] but I just know who they are and their character.

[00:33:06] So most of my team has either come from people

[00:33:09] that I've known for a long time that have been in that space.

[00:33:12] I just wasn't ready to partner with them earlier on,

[00:33:15] but I got to see kind of what they were doing.

[00:33:17] And I know that they're good people.

[00:33:20] From that perspective, and then a lot of my other partnerships

[00:33:22] and different things like that, again, it comes from referrals,

[00:33:25] comes from different people that, you know, the guys that are doing high rises.

[00:33:28] Hey, I'm looking to get in this space, but I want to do something smaller.

[00:33:31] Oh, let me refer you to this guy that does more infield stuff, right?

[00:33:34] More smaller 60 unit type stuff or whatever it may be.

[00:33:37] So I'm big on networking. I'm big on networking.

[00:33:41] I used to be honest with you.

[00:33:42] I used to hate it with a passion when I played it,

[00:33:45] because it was just when I was like, oh, I got to go to this thing again.

[00:33:48] I got to sign autograph.

[00:33:50] That sounds kind of like it sounds real.

[00:33:54] It sounds crazy.

[00:33:55] You know, it's like it's like Marshawn.

[00:33:57] What did Marshawn say?

[00:33:58] I'm here because I'm required to be here or something like that.

[00:34:01] I'm here so I don't get fired.

[00:34:02] But what I realized was like that whole notion of

[00:34:07] what we used to hear growing up is it's not what you know,

[00:34:09] it's who you know, is so true in the business world.

[00:34:12] You know what I mean?

[00:34:13] Like just your network of people, what they're doing and hey, man,

[00:34:17] do you have somebody that can do whatever?

[00:34:19] Oh, yeah. Let me refer you to the same concept with building up my team

[00:34:23] is asking questions, being OK, being vulnerable and saying,

[00:34:26] I don't know how to do this and getting with people that are in that space

[00:34:30] and they refer you to other people or you build relationships

[00:34:33] and you go from there.

[00:34:34] But it's been all referral or people that I've just known for a while.

[00:34:37] Yeah, I've replaced networking with the word networking with making friends.

[00:34:41] And it helps. It does. It does.

[00:34:44] And I tell guys this all the time, too, when I go talk to some of the guys

[00:34:47] in the locker room, hey, you should be networking, but make it genuine.

[00:34:50] I'm just hey, give me your number. Hey, what are you doing?

[00:34:52] How much money do you make? No, make it genuine.

[00:34:54] Like get to know people, get to know people and then things will come from that.

[00:34:58] But yeah, you can't just come in.

[00:35:00] Hey, man, let's do this deal together.

[00:35:02] No, no, no, no, no. Get to know me folks first.

[00:35:04] Yep. Yep. Yeah.

[00:35:05] Tate and I kind of preach that on the podcast.

[00:35:08] There's so many conferences, meetups, podcasts, books, people to meet.

[00:35:12] That was one thing that I did early on was I listened to, you know,

[00:35:15] thousands of these podcasts and then I got to know who the hosts were

[00:35:17] and then went to their conferences or whatever and met with them

[00:35:20] and ended up speaking at their events or whatever.

[00:35:22] And that's how Tate and I got connected

[00:35:23] and have done deals together and do this podcast together.

[00:35:26] It's huge. And just to sit behind a computer and just analyze deals all day,

[00:35:29] you're not going to you're not going to move the needle.

[00:35:31] And you got to get out there.

[00:35:33] So that's really great. It's teamwork. It's teamwork.

[00:35:36] You're just building out a team of people in

[00:35:38] and getting with people that have different skill sets.

[00:35:42] It's again, football.

[00:35:43] You only need one quarterback out there, but you need five

[00:35:45] O-linemen to block for me.

[00:35:46] You need a running back. You need a fullback.

[00:35:48] You need a title like you need all these different pieces

[00:35:51] in order for that guy to have success.

[00:35:53] But you need so it's all about building your team out.

[00:35:56] But people with different skill sets to be able to get you

[00:35:58] in the right position to be able to have success is huge.

[00:36:01] I take it into OT. I got one more.

[00:36:02] I want to leave people with something that they can get amped up on.

[00:36:05] So, Cliff, you're a Super Bowl champion.

[00:36:08] Can you tell us give us give the listeners

[00:36:11] how do you play like a champion every day?

[00:36:13] You come to this podcast with a ton of energy.

[00:36:16] Like I'm more energized just being around you.

[00:36:19] How do you play like a champion?

[00:36:20] How do you go out on that field, give it your all?

[00:36:22] What would you recommend people bring into their everyday life

[00:36:26] to to give it their all, play like a champion in their everyday life?

[00:36:30] So it's funny you say that.

[00:36:31] So I would say first and foremost, I have this little notebook

[00:36:35] says gratitude on it.

[00:36:37] I write in it every morning before I start work.

[00:36:39] And I think that's the first step is just understanding.

[00:36:43] And I don't care where you're at, what was it like understanding that?

[00:36:47] Hey, we people ask me, hey, how are you doing?

[00:36:50] I'm like, hey, I woke up this morning.

[00:36:51] I can battle the rest. Right.

[00:36:52] And that's a real statement to me because

[00:36:55] you don't control waking up in the morning.

[00:36:56] Like you just wake up.

[00:36:58] So so like being thankful for the day and then moving through it

[00:37:04] that way, I think helps me out tremendously.

[00:37:06] Just having gratitude.

[00:37:07] And then number two is like my goals

[00:37:12] and my aspiration are bigger than whatever headache

[00:37:17] or hiccup I have going on in the moment.

[00:37:20] So I won't allow the small, tedious things or I try not to.

[00:37:23] I'm human being.

[00:37:24] I try not to allow the small, tedious things,

[00:37:27] whether it's the wife yelling about whatever the budget

[00:37:30] we're over budget over here or what I do know is I'm in the game.

[00:37:34] And if I continue to keep putting the best foot forward,

[00:37:36] I will have success and be patient with that.

[00:37:40] Because I do think we live in a society now where

[00:37:43] you look at Instagram, you look at all these social media outlets

[00:37:46] and we just see the finished product.

[00:37:47] We just see the guys on Sunday.

[00:37:49] But we don't realize the work that these guys

[00:37:50] have been putting in since January to be able to perform in August

[00:37:53] or in September, October, November. Right.

[00:37:56] I understand that process.

[00:37:57] And I apply myself that way every day.

[00:38:01] As you guys know, in real estate, you might go eight, nine months a year,

[00:38:05] 14, 15 months without getting paid. Right.

[00:38:08] Are you going to be patient enough to continue to keep moving forward

[00:38:10] in that space? And I guarantee you, if you do,

[00:38:14] there is either a learning lesson or and some money on the back end of that.

[00:38:17] But you have to continue to keep moving forward.

[00:38:19] I was I said a lot right there, but I would say it again is gratitude.

[00:38:23] And then continue to just get in the game and continue

[00:38:26] to keep moving forward, no matter what the hiccups are.

[00:38:28] It's a roller coaster ride, but you will get to the finish.

[00:38:30] I love it. All right.

[00:38:31] Favorite game outside the favorite game outside.

[00:38:33] Oh, what favorite game outside of the Super Bowl?

[00:38:36] Oh, now I've had quite a few of my guys, man.

[00:38:39] That NFC Championship game against San Francisco

[00:38:41] before the Super Bowl was pretty fun. Yeah.

[00:38:44] I learned a lot about myself and how I apply myself now

[00:38:49] with the second NFC Championship game against Green Bay when we were down.

[00:38:54] I don't know, 16 points or something like that with six minutes left

[00:38:58] and still found a way to win like that game in particular is again,

[00:39:03] how I choose to approach things when it comes down to real estate.

[00:39:07] But really life, it doesn't matter how it's going right now.

[00:39:10] If I continue, if I put the work in,

[00:39:13] the results will be what I want them to be at some point.

[00:39:16] I just got to keep moving forward. Yeah.

[00:39:18] Well, we're the most important people in your on your team

[00:39:22] and in the business world now.

[00:39:24] Most important people on my team, I would say first and foremost,

[00:39:27] is my executive assistant. She's awesome.

[00:39:30] Y'all probably were actually communicating with her on kind of getting this all

[00:39:33] scheduled or whatever, but she's awesome in a sense of like

[00:39:36] what I found myself doing early on was I was too much in the weeds

[00:39:40] of doing the small tedious stuff, email schedules,

[00:39:46] all these different meetings and whatever else.

[00:39:48] And putting her in place and basically buying my time back

[00:39:52] to be able to go network more, right?

[00:39:53] Being able to go out and do the things that will move the needle.

[00:39:57] Building out my team from that perspective.

[00:39:59] So I would definitely give her the number one piece, my envy.

[00:40:02] I don't worry my you know, if you be player,

[00:40:04] I need you to play like such right.

[00:40:07] It would be her and then my asset managers.

[00:40:10] I have a couple of asset managers that I brought on on a couple of deals.

[00:40:14] They deal with the day to day stuff

[00:40:15] with the property managers and I deal with them.

[00:40:18] So just build out an infrastructure.

[00:40:19] But yeah, I would say those are probably my one two punches right there

[00:40:22] as far as for those that I think are extremely important.

[00:40:26] And then of course, my business partners,

[00:40:27] whether it be the general contractor or not,

[00:40:29] those guys are extremely important as well.

[00:40:31] But first place is for sure my girl Keisha.

[00:40:34] She's she's the MVP for CA Family Properties.

[00:40:36] That's incredible.

[00:40:38] Well, Cliff, first of all, thank you.

[00:40:39] Thank you for coming onto the show.

[00:40:41] One of the last questions that we have for you today

[00:40:45] and I really appreciate your time.

[00:40:46] This has been a lot of fun.

[00:40:47] Your most rewarding achievement in post NFL.

[00:40:51] What has been the most rewarding achievement?

[00:40:54] Man, that's a great one.

[00:40:56] I think the most rewarding achievement that I've had outside.

[00:41:02] I mean, I guess it's not an achievement.

[00:41:03] Being a great dad is not what you should be doing.

[00:41:08] I would say I would say I would say from a business perspective

[00:41:11] is what kind of the story I said earlier is like my mom being more.

[00:41:17] Involved in want to learn more about business.

[00:41:20] My mom is sixty three.

[00:41:22] It's going to be sixty five this year.

[00:41:24] And like her just being so excited about her quarterly checks,

[00:41:27] her quarterly distributions is so cool to me because I'm really teaching

[00:41:32] my mom like the game that she never knew existed, never understood.

[00:41:38] I never really had the time to try to pick it up or anything like that,

[00:41:41] but really setting her up for retirement.

[00:41:44] She wants to retire in the next four to five years.

[00:41:46] And she's adamant about being able to like,

[00:41:50] she knows I'm a lookout for, of course,

[00:41:51] and I'm probably going to take on the bulk.

[00:41:53] But she's very adamant about making sure that she brings something to the table

[00:41:57] to when she retires and that's investing.

[00:42:01] And she was just telling me this.

[00:42:02] I can't believe I've even had that much money to invest.

[00:42:05] Like, I never I never even saved that much money.

[00:42:07] But now that I'm so locked in on being able to invest with you,

[00:42:10] like I'm realizing I'm able to put this money away

[00:42:12] and I'm getting these distributions and I'm not spending that money

[00:42:15] because I want to reinvest it again.

[00:42:16] Like you're learning something, mom.

[00:42:18] I like that. I like that.

[00:42:19] So that's very rewarding.

[00:42:21] That's hugely rewarding.

[00:42:23] Yeah, that's hugely that's the best thing ever.

[00:42:25] I mean, that I don't know.

[00:42:27] I know you're proud, but yeah, no, amazing.

[00:42:29] Yeah, I love it.

[00:42:31] I love it. Yeah, she's super excited.

[00:42:33] She's asking questions.

[00:42:34] She's learning and she she has a she has a game plan and she wants to execute it.

[00:42:38] So it's cool to see.

[00:42:39] That's awesome. That's great.

[00:42:42] Cliff, we really appreciate your time.

[00:42:44] This has been an absolute joy having you on.

[00:42:46] And for those listening, remember,

[00:42:47] we got a growing Facebook community of aviators and investors.

[00:42:51] So look us up, passive income pilots, or you can any questions

[00:42:54] that you have that you want us to answer on the show.

[00:42:56] You can always go to ask at passive income pilots dot com.

[00:42:59] That's our email address. Ask at passive income pilots dot com.

[00:43:02] We value your input and look forward to exploring more

[00:43:05] and inspiring more people and stories together.

[00:43:07] So with that, we'll catch you on the next episode.